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	<title>Comments on: Rand Paul: Unprincipled Hero</title>
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	<description>Your home for traditional conservatism.</description>
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		<title>By: Mike M.</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-4/#comment-200485</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jun 2010 20:56:03 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Getting back to Dr. Paul&#039;s effectiveness, I vote for him every other year to be at least one tent stake against the DC whirlwind that continually tries to hurl us into the abyss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Getting back to Dr. Paul's effectiveness, I vote for him every other year to be at least one tent stake against the DC whirlwind that continually tries to hurl us into the abyss.</p>
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		<title>By: The virtue of pragmatism? Winning. &#124; Conservative Heritage Times</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-4/#comment-200469</link>
		<dc:creator>The virtue of pragmatism? Winning. &#124; Conservative Heritage Times</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jun 2010 05:02:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200469</guid>
		<description>[...] been been a lot of discussion about Rand Paul&#8217;s pragmatism, in regards to what he really believes and what he&#8217;ll say [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] been been a lot of discussion about Rand Paul&#8217;s pragmatism, in regards to what he really believes and what he&#8217;ll say [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-4/#comment-200440</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jun 2010 20:07:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200440</guid>
		<description>@S. L. Toddard 151


Well, there&#039;s St Louis of France:

&quot;No one ought to dispute with Jews unless he be a very good clerk; but the layman, when he heareth the Christian law spoken against, ought not to defend it save with the sword, which he should thrust as far as it will go into the unbeliever&#039;s belly.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@S. L. Toddard 151</p>
<p>Well, there's St Louis of France:</p>
<p>"No one ought to dispute with Jews unless he be a very good clerk; but the layman, when he heareth the Christian law spoken against, ought not to defend it save with the sword, which he should thrust as far as it will go into the unbeliever's belly."</p>
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		<title>By: S.L. Toddard</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-4/#comment-200414</link>
		<dc:creator>S.L. Toddard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jun 2010 12:35:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200414</guid>
		<description>&quot;I told him that some arguments, as an ancient philosopher said, should be answered not with reason but with a blow of the fist&quot;

Who said this, Dr. Fleming?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>"I told him that some arguments, as an ancient philosopher said, should be answered not with reason but with a blow of the fist"</p>
<p>Who said this, Dr. Fleming?</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Fleming</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-3/#comment-200408</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Fleming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 21:59:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200408</guid>
		<description>A friend just called from France to express horror at some of the arguments being put forward in language that lowers the dignity of the human person and human life.  I told him that some arguments, as an ancient philosopher said, should be answered not with reason but with a  blow of the fist.  We are not going to permit arguments in favor of incest or adultery and certainly not going to tolerate pseudo-scientific language about unborn babies, whatever status we wish to assign them.  The arrogant assumption that man, through scientific procedures, may intervene in the course of nature approved by the Creator has a home nearly everywhere else but not here.  That is why I have refused to enter into such a discussion and started a different line of reasoning beginning with human duty.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A friend just called from France to express horror at some of the arguments being put forward in language that lowers the dignity of the human person and human life.  I told him that some arguments, as an ancient philosopher said, should be answered not with reason but with a  blow of the fist.  We are not going to permit arguments in favor of incest or adultery and certainly not going to tolerate pseudo-scientific language about unborn babies, whatever status we wish to assign them.  The arrogant assumption that man, through scientific procedures, may intervene in the course of nature approved by the Creator has a home nearly everywhere else but not here.  That is why I have refused to enter into such a discussion and started a different line of reasoning beginning with human duty.</p>
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		<title>By: robert</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-3/#comment-200399</link>
		<dc:creator>robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 18:55:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200399</guid>
		<description>Dr. Fleming,
  You know I have come to like KDZ. There is something admirable about his dogged determination that I very much admire. Plus he is a good sport and serious about this issue. The problem I have with KDZ is he seems to be invincibly confused about whether life is a good thing, a bad thing, a between thing, a nuanced thing, a thing like a gall bladder, a thing not really worth pursuing, a thing initially, perhaps, like a fish egg, and finally  something definitely Cartesian full of extension and quantity but qualified for existence in only certain cases.   Here is a poem describing a time when men from different shifts and walks of life would mow around flowers out of respect for their,brief beauty and the rites of haying in early Summer.(something like the greeks pooring out libations on strange land or tithing etc.)  We don&#039;t have anything like this left in our culture except in a very few out of the way places. We mow over everything in the name of efficiency -- even life itself.
 \
I went to turn the grass once after one
Who mowed it in the dew before the sun.

The dew was gone that made his blade so keen
Before I came to view the levelled scene. 

I looked for him behind an isle of trees;
I listened for his whetstone on the breeze. 

But he had gone his way, the grass all mown,
And I must be, as he had been,--alone, 

`As all must be,&#039; I said within my heart,
`Whether they work together or apart.&#039; 

But as I said it, swift there passed me by
On noiseless wing a &#039;wildered butterfly, 

Seeking with memories grown dim o&#039;er night
Some resting flower of yesterday&#039;s delight. 

And once I marked his flight go round and round,
As where some flower lay withering on the ground. 

And then he flew as far as eye could see,
And then on tremulous wing came back to me. 

I thought of questions that have no reply,
And would have turned to toss the grass to dry; 

But he turned first, and led my eye to look
At a tall tuft of flowers beside a brook, 

A leaping tongue of bloom the scythe had spared
Beside a reedy brook the scythe had bared. 

I left my place to know them by their name,
Finding them butterfly weed when I came. 

The mower in the dew had loved them thus,
By leaving them to flourish, not for us, 

Nor yet to draw one thought of ours to him.
But from sheer morning gladness at the brim. 

The butterfly and I had lit upon,
Nevertheless, a message from the dawn, 

That made me hear the wakening birds around,
And hear his long scythe whispering to the ground, 

And feel a spirit kindred to my own;
So that henceforth I worked no more alone; 

But glad with him, I worked as with his aid,
And weary, sought at noon with him the shade; 

And dreaming, as it were, held brotherly speech
With one whose thought I had not hoped to reach. 

`Men work together,&#039; I told him from the heart,
`Whether they work together or apart.&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr. Fleming,<br />
  You know I have come to like KDZ. There is something admirable about his dogged determination that I very much admire. Plus he is a good sport and serious about this issue. The problem I have with KDZ is he seems to be invincibly confused about whether life is a good thing, a bad thing, a between thing, a nuanced thing, a thing like a gall bladder, a thing not really worth pursuing, a thing initially, perhaps, like a fish egg, and finally  something definitely Cartesian full of extension and quantity but qualified for existence in only certain cases.   Here is a poem describing a time when men from different shifts and walks of life would mow around flowers out of respect for their,brief beauty and the rites of haying in early Summer.(something like the greeks pooring out libations on strange land or tithing etc.)  We don't have anything like this left in our culture except in a very few out of the way places. We mow over everything in the name of efficiency -- even life itself.<br />
 \<br />
I went to turn the grass once after one<br />
Who mowed it in the dew before the sun.</p>
<p>The dew was gone that made his blade so keen<br />
Before I came to view the levelled scene. </p>
<p>I looked for him behind an isle of trees;<br />
I listened for his whetstone on the breeze. </p>
<p>But he had gone his way, the grass all mown,<br />
And I must be, as he had been,--alone, </p>
<p>`As all must be,' I said within my heart,<br />
`Whether they work together or apart.' </p>
<p>But as I said it, swift there passed me by<br />
On noiseless wing a 'wildered butterfly, </p>
<p>Seeking with memories grown dim o'er night<br />
Some resting flower of yesterday's delight. </p>
<p>And once I marked his flight go round and round,<br />
As where some flower lay withering on the ground. </p>
<p>And then he flew as far as eye could see,<br />
And then on tremulous wing came back to me. </p>
<p>I thought of questions that have no reply,<br />
And would have turned to toss the grass to dry; </p>
<p>But he turned first, and led my eye to look<br />
At a tall tuft of flowers beside a brook, </p>
<p>A leaping tongue of bloom the scythe had spared<br />
Beside a reedy brook the scythe had bared. </p>
<p>I left my place to know them by their name,<br />
Finding them butterfly weed when I came. </p>
<p>The mower in the dew had loved them thus,<br />
By leaving them to flourish, not for us, </p>
<p>Nor yet to draw one thought of ours to him.<br />
But from sheer morning gladness at the brim. </p>
<p>The butterfly and I had lit upon,<br />
Nevertheless, a message from the dawn, </p>
<p>That made me hear the wakening birds around,<br />
And hear his long scythe whispering to the ground, </p>
<p>And feel a spirit kindred to my own;<br />
So that henceforth I worked no more alone; </p>
<p>But glad with him, I worked as with his aid,<br />
And weary, sought at noon with him the shade; </p>
<p>And dreaming, as it were, held brotherly speech<br />
With one whose thought I had not hoped to reach. </p>
<p>`Men work together,' I told him from the heart,<br />
`Whether they work together or apart.'</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Fleming</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-3/#comment-200393</link>
		<dc:creator>Thomas Fleming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 16:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200393</guid>
		<description>I fear I have been too hard on poor KDZ, who appears to have  gone stark raving mad.  By the way, hopefully does not mean &quot;one may hope&quot; like German hoffentlich, but in a hopeful manner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I fear I have been too hard on poor KDZ, who appears to have  gone stark raving mad.  By the way, hopefully does not mean "one may hope" like German hoffentlich, but in a hopeful manner.</p>
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		<title>By: Chesterbelloc</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-3/#comment-200374</link>
		<dc:creator>Chesterbelloc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 May 2010 23:22:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200374</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s fine.  Responding to some of the comments on this page sure wouldn&#039;t put me in the best mood, either.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That's fine.  Responding to some of the comments on this page sure wouldn't put me in the best mood, either.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Schaeber</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-3/#comment-200373</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Schaeber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 May 2010 21:43:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200373</guid>
		<description>JDS @ 125 writes:

&quot;Plus I’m even still undecided whether I’ll vote in the general election or not. The mere thought of voting makes me feel rather dirty, and I sometimes wonder if muddled men with good intentions haven’t done almost as much damage to the world as outright villains.&quot;

It seems to me that that would depend on where you live.  If you are in one of the provinces that permits non-Duopoly parties to run candidates, that is a (minor) point in favor of doing so.

But let&#039;s be realistic, friends: real, substantive political change---something on the order of the end of &quot;entitlements&quot;, or of actually returning property owners control over who they serve or hire or do business with---is simply not possible under current social conditions.  The central government, its provincial subsidiaries and those who control (not necessarily &quot;run&quot; them) have subverted too many formerly independent social institutions to make a wholesale reversion likely.

If Dr. Fleming will permit, I would like to offer my two cents on what one may actually do to address the problem.  Not &quot;solve&quot;; that one&#039;s probably a non-starter.  But it may be possible to light the candle rather than curse the darkness.

First: turn off the television !  Disengaging the Foolish Box (iPods/iBooks/iPads/Blackberries qualify as different species of the genus &quot;Box Idiotic&quot;, IMO) allows you to at least engage your brain in &quot;active&quot; mode.  It also gives you the resource you need to affect your immediate environment most: time.

Second: Make sure that your children know where you stand, and more importantly, why.  Believe me, they listen more than you know.  This is critical; even if they don&#039;t remember the specifics of what you say, you give them the most important piece of information---that there is something to know, something that is DIFFERENT, something that does not fit into the accepted illusion promulgated by the school/media/corporate complex.

Third: preserve those elements of our culture that you can.  Build yourself a library, and make sure the kids see you reading from it early and often.  Just by reading and not watching the latest re-run of &quot;LOST&quot;/&quot;South Park&quot;/&quot;American Idol&quot;, you&#039;re committing one of the most subversive of all possible acts in this candy-cane culture we are marinated in.

These three things will be more than enough for most us.  If you absolutely believe that you MUST &quot;vote&quot; for reasons other than entertainment (and entertainment is an excellent reason to at least follow the process; good Theatre of the Absurd is a minor treasure in an absurd world), then do so.  It gets you out of the house, you get a chance for 30 seconds&#039; peace and quiet in the voting booth, and sometimes you can see some really funny (funny-strange, as well as funny-haha) people campaigning.

But realize that voting is like buying a lottery ticket; it should only be done with the realization that your chances of &quot;winning&quot; are marginal, and in the same spirit as the mouse demonstrates in the &quot;Last Great Act of Defiance&quot; poster.

I offer these for whatever they are worth.  No doubt this post and $ 1 will get me a copy of &quot;Our Nation&#039;s Journal of Scholarly Excellence&quot;, USA Today. I thank you all in advance for your indulgence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JDS @ 125 writes:</p>
<p>"Plus I’m even still undecided whether I’ll vote in the general election or not. The mere thought of voting makes me feel rather dirty, and I sometimes wonder if muddled men with good intentions haven’t done almost as much damage to the world as outright villains."</p>
<p>It seems to me that that would depend on where you live.  If you are in one of the provinces that permits non-Duopoly parties to run candidates, that is a (minor) point in favor of doing so.</p>
<p>But let's be realistic, friends: real, substantive political change---something on the order of the end of "entitlements", or of actually returning property owners control over who they serve or hire or do business with---is simply not possible under current social conditions.  The central government, its provincial subsidiaries and those who control (not necessarily "run" them) have subverted too many formerly independent social institutions to make a wholesale reversion likely.</p>
<p>If Dr. Fleming will permit, I would like to offer my two cents on what one may actually do to address the problem.  Not "solve"; that one's probably a non-starter.  But it may be possible to light the candle rather than curse the darkness.</p>
<p>First: turn off the television !  Disengaging the Foolish Box (iPods/iBooks/iPads/Blackberries qualify as different species of the genus "Box Idiotic", IMO) allows you to at least engage your brain in "active" mode.  It also gives you the resource you need to affect your immediate environment most: time.</p>
<p>Second: Make sure that your children know where you stand, and more importantly, why.  Believe me, they listen more than you know.  This is critical; even if they don't remember the specifics of what you say, you give them the most important piece of information---that there is something to know, something that is DIFFERENT, something that does not fit into the accepted illusion promulgated by the school/media/corporate complex.</p>
<p>Third: preserve those elements of our culture that you can.  Build yourself a library, and make sure the kids see you reading from it early and often.  Just by reading and not watching the latest re-run of "LOST"/"South Park"/"American Idol", you're committing one of the most subversive of all possible acts in this candy-cane culture we are marinated in.</p>
<p>These three things will be more than enough for most us.  If you absolutely believe that you MUST "vote" for reasons other than entertainment (and entertainment is an excellent reason to at least follow the process; good Theatre of the Absurd is a minor treasure in an absurd world), then do so.  It gets you out of the house, you get a chance for 30 seconds' peace and quiet in the voting booth, and sometimes you can see some really funny (funny-strange, as well as funny-haha) people campaigning.</p>
<p>But realize that voting is like buying a lottery ticket; it should only be done with the realization that your chances of "winning" are marginal, and in the same spirit as the mouse demonstrates in the "Last Great Act of Defiance" poster.</p>
<p>I offer these for whatever they are worth.  No doubt this post and $ 1 will get me a copy of "Our Nation's Journal of Scholarly Excellence", USA Today. I thank you all in advance for your indulgence.</p>
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		<title>By: Tjf</title>
		<link>http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/2010/05/25/rand-paul-unprincipled-hero/comment-page-3/#comment-200370</link>
		<dc:creator>Tjf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 May 2010 20:27:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.chroniclesmagazine.org/?p=4352#comment-200370</guid>
		<description>Writing in haste I was much too severe.  Chesterton would surely take me to task for my presumption.  Please use your moniker and accept my apology</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Writing in haste I was much too severe.  Chesterton would surely take me to task for my presumption.  Please use your moniker and accept my apology</p>
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