Serbian Election: Socialists, the Unexpected Kingmakers
Last Sunday night, as the results of Serbia’s parliamentary elections became known, the country’s President Boris Tadić made a remarkable statement. “I warn the parties that have lost this election,” he declared, “not to play games with the will of the citizens and try to form a government that would take Serbia back to the 1990s. I will not allow any such government and I will prevent it by democratic means.” This was not just an ill-considered gaffe in the heat of the election night: on Wednesday he was at it again, criticizing attempts by his political opponents to form the government and pledging to “defend the will of the people with all democratic and legitimate means.”
The implications of Mr. Tadić’s statement are clear, and alarming:
- There exists a “will of the citizens” (or “people”) that is distinct to, and in this case different from that expressed in the distribution of mandates in the National Assembly;
- The “losers”—by which he means the outgoing Prime Minister Vojislav Koštunica’s Democratic Party of Serbia (DSS) and the Radicals (SRS)—would plunge Serbia into wars and isolation (“back to the 1990s”).
- It is within Tadić’s power as head of state to prevent the emergence of a coalition government not to his liking, even if such a coalition were to be supported by the majority of parliamentary deputies.
Tadić’s first claim harks back to Rousseau’s volonté générale that properly guides the decisions of a civil society, rather than the sum of their individual self-interests, the volonté de tous. His assertion is in line with the postmodern USA-EU understanding of “democracy,” which judges a process democratic entirely on the basis of the “rightness” of its outcome. His European and American mentors have long used the term “democracy” as an ideological concept. It does not signify broad participation of informed citizens in the business of governance, but it denotes the desirable social and political content of ostensibly popular decisions. The process likely to produce undesirable outcomes—a sovereignist coalition government in Belgrade, say, or a “no” vote in the Irish referendum on the Lisbon Treaty—is a priori “undemocratic.” Contrary to his frankly outrageous claim, the common good is an aggregate of private interests which needs balancing and fine-tuning through the institutions of representative democracy. After such outbursts it is ridiculous to misrepresent Tadić as a “pro-Western democrat,” although he is certain to be thus described in a thousand MSM reports that are yet to be written.
Tadić’s Democratic Party (DS) did well at the election, considerably better than expected, but it did not “win.” With 102 deputies in the 250-seat assembly, the Democrats will be 24 seats short of the working majority. Even with the like-minded Liberal Democratic Party of Čedomir Jovanović (14 deputies) and a couple of small ethnic minority parties (Hungarians, Sanjak Muslims), the DS cannot reach the magic number.
The Socialist Party of Serbia (SPS), with 20 deputies, is now the decisive factor in the equation, certain to decide the shape of the next ruling coalition. It will likely join forces with Koštunica’s DSS (30 deputies) and the Radicals (78) to create a government with a slim but workable majority. Its leader Ivica Dačić may yet be tempted by the DS, which is certain to make him a generous offer, but his party leadership has warned him that any such deal would split the party. It still includes numerous Milošević loyalists who have not forgiven the Democrats—then led by the late prime minister Zoran Djindjić—the delivery of their leader to The Hague in 2001.
An agreement is already said to be in place between Dačić, Koštunica and the SRS to share power in the city of Belgrade, with the Radicals’ No. 3, Aleksandar Vučić, becoming the new Mayor. The speed and ease with which the deal was struck on the country’s second most important government structure—with its many rich pickings—bodes ill for Tadić’s hopes that the SPS may yet be swayed his way.
The pro-Western camp is nevertheless trying hard. After almost a decade of relentless political and media campaign by the DS and its allies against the SPS, after years of public demonization of its late leader, the “Euro-reformist forces” have suddenly discovered that the Socialists are eminently salonfaehig. Tadić is now declaring that there are practically no ideological differences between the heirs to Milošević and his own followers, as they are both true to the principles of the Socialist International. Yet less than two years ago, when this same Socialist Party—under the same leader and with the same program—supported Koštunica’s minority goverrnment, it was pilloried by the Euro-reformers as a dark and temporary remnant of Serbia’s unpleasant past.
Even if he manages to cobble together yet another coalition with himself at the helm, the biggest loser of the election is my old friend Vojislav Koštunica. He is a well-meaning man of principle, as we all know, and his decision on March 8 to “return the mandate to the people” may have been the honorable thing to do—but in the midst of the Kosovo crisis it was neither prudent nor conducive to the country’s best interests. Within the previous parliament, elected on January 21 2007, a “sovereignist” majority could have been created with far greater ease than today. Dr. Koštunica is now paying the price of his reluctance to part ways with the Eurofanatics and strike a solid deal with the Radicals a year ago, as many of his friends and supporters had urged him to do at the time and as it was certainly in his power to do.
Serbia is now more polarized and more evenly divided, but it is nevertheless far from having an “Euro-reformist” majority, as Mr. Tadić and his allies would have us believe. His DS-led coalition and the LDP, let us repeat, have 116 deputies. That is well below the score for the SRS-DSS-led emerging alliance, which is likely to stand firm on the defense of Serbia’s sovereignty, territorial integrity and international legality.
After almost 8 years in the wilderness the Socialists are Belgrade’s unexpected kingmakers. It is to be hoped that by doing the right thing now they will atone for at least some of the many mistakes and misdemeanors of which they were guilty while running Serbia under Milošević. It is also to be hoped that Mr. Tadić will respect his constitutional prerogatives and accordingly refrain from any attempt to resist the will of the people, as expressed by their democratically elected deputies.
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Mr. Trifkovic: I think you are too hard on Milosevic.
He was the head of the Serbian State under the most difficult circumstances imaginable he didn't create himself,and it is not surprising that he made mistakes. His main mistake was that he trusted Clinton. (Milosevic was an "apparatchik" who never understood who was running America.)
It is not fair that he is declared guilty of everybody's sins, past, present and the future.
He should be remembered as somebody who stood up for Serbia and lost -- including his life.
Can you imagine this 'hochstappler' Tadic doing the same?
I was wondering the political make up of Serbia is.
- Who controls is major industries
- Are Kosovo crime gangs operating in Serbia,
- Who controls the media,
- how many NGOs are operating in Serbia,
- Is the independent press independent or is it run by the likes of George Soros
- And are human rights groups like Human Rights Watch run by a NGO front like Carneige Endowment in Russia http://www.rusjournal.com/ngos.html.
It would be interesting to know as I think what happens in Serbia is a future blueprint for what Brezinski and his gang have planned for Russia.
I think this article by Nebojsa Malic sums up political gullibility and stupidity of SM quite nicely:
http://www.balkan-archive.org.yu/kosovo_crisis/Sep_04/6.html
Money quote: "At last, we have seen the enemy. And it was us all along."
(james @2)
And the most important question:
- Who controls the military?
@4M
Actually the most important question is who controls the banks in Serbia.
Thomas Jefferson said it best that international bankers and financiers controling the nations currency is more dangerous than any military
Milosevic lost the PR war. He should have used the Hague trail to dispell the many myths of the Balkans wars. Even Ernst Zundel was able to show his views when put on trail for holocaust denial in Canada, some have even made him a free speach martyr on the internet. All Milosevic did was to release press statements that the western media didn't report.
james @5
Yes, ultimately, the control of money does come first.
My comment pertained specifically to the ominous overt threats that traitor Tadic is presently making on behalf of his frustrated masters. Thus, who (if anyone) at this very moment has effective control of the military is paramount. Though hopefully and most likely this will not come to fore.
- Who controls is major industries?
Mostly foreigners. Serbs would be surprised to find out how much Israel is involved in the Serbian economy. As a cover they use a few "Serbian oligarchs"
- Are Kosovo crime gangs operating in Serbia?
Wouldn't surprise me. "Serbian" underground is well known for cooperating with the Croatian one, too.
- Who controls the media?
The very same ones who control media in the USA.
- How many NGOs are operating in Serbia?
Dozens, but there are few that are particularly offensive.
- Is the independent press independent or is it run by the likes of George Soros?
The latter, exactly.
- And are human rights groups like Human Rights Watch run by a NGO front like Carneige Endowment in Russia?
Read the answer to the question above.
Well up till now I have been agreeing with you more often than not. However this time, you Dr. Trifkovic and your friend Dr. Kostunica have made a fatal mistake and undermined your own credibility. As odious as the proeuropean alliance is, there is no excuse for backing the Radical ideology or looking forward to an alliance with Milosevic's pupils, reigniting a failed nationalist ideology that can only lead to new defeats while freezing the social and economic makeup of the society for the benefit of the UDBA alumni. It is no wonder that DDS suffered such a huge loss in this election. You cannot be in two places at the same time Dr. Trifkovic. You cannot have democracy while allowing a 60 year old criminal enterprise to continue to exist. YOu cannot ever free Kosovo if you are going to let criminals run the country. ( anticipating your answer,an implication that DS is just as criminal is just another rationalisation why not to fight for what is right and discrediting oneself by associating with unreliable and dubious company)If you are not willing to fight those who really need to be fought (and I am sure that a man of your intelligence or Dr. Kostunica for that matter know who is really running everything,) then you are a sellout and I feel sorry about it.
According to the newspaper Vecernje Novosti an agreement to form a new government in Serbia was reached on thursday evening 19:10 local time. The socialists have agreed on a coalition with SRS and DSS, who agreed on a four principle program the day before. The socialist inserted one more principle (social justice) into the program.
"As odious as the proeuropean alliance is, there is no excuse for backing the Radical ideology or looking forward to an alliance with Milosevic’s pupils, reigniting a failed nationalist ideology that can only lead to new defeats while freezing the social and economic makeup of the society for the benefit of the UDBA alumni. It is no wonder that DDS suffered such a huge loss in this election. You cannot be in two places at the same time Dr. Trifkovic."
****
Fascinating observations from the above quoted. If I'm not mistaken, Solana was cited as saying that there might not be Western objections if the Socialists (the party identified to Milosevic) were to ally themselves with Tadic.
This is the kind of political dancing that some in Western neocon/neolib officialdom allow for themselves, while piously denouncing it of others who they disagree with.
I seem to recall that upon signing the Clinton administration encouraged Dayton Accords in 1995, Anthony Lewis and Richard Holbrooke significantly changed their characterizaion of Milosevic. This at a time when he faced noticeable unpopulatrity in Serbia.
Tadic's seeming democracy lecture reminds me of those sources who bash Russia, Germany and France for not being so gung ho on Ukraine joining NATO; without mentioning that most Ukrainians oppose their country joining NATO.
Mr. Trifkovic,
You look like a much happier chap in your previous photo. Have these elections really depressed you so much?
Even if the SPS is bribed or threatened into supporting Tadic, it will not be the end of Serbia.
The Radicals control Belgrade, Nis and possibly Novi Sad. These three cities probably control half of Serbia's GNP. And should the Tadic's Democrats take any steps that might threaten Serbia's position on Kosovo, then the SPS could leave the coalition.
Whatever happens, Tadic has very limited room for manoeuvre.
@ James (#5)
For your information, Milosevic died (murdered?) exactly when he was beginning to call his witnesses. The number one on his list was, guess who? the famous humanitarian warrior Bill Clinton.
How convenient for him the sudden disappearance of Milosevic.
To (#11) Michael Thomas: I look much more like my current self here. I am almost 54, for goodness' sake, which is cca 2/3-life-crisis-time: No more youthful indiscretions and frivolity. No more Mr Nice Guy. Joie de vivre every step of the remaining way, of course!
A small correction. DS will not hold 102 seats in the new assembly.
102 mandates were won by the coalition "For a European Serbia" of which DS is the largest, but not the only member.
The 102 seats will be distributed approximatley like this:
62 - DS
29 - G17+ (which grants one of its seats to DSHV)
4 - SDP
4 - SPO
3 - LSV
So, a curious thing is that the Radicals with 78 mandates are again the largest party.
Are quisling Tadić's masters in DC & Brussels howling in pain
Headlines from today’s DSS web site http://www.dss.org.yu [my translation]
16 May 2008
The president of Democratic Party of Serbia Vojislav Koštunica stated today that Coalition DSS-NS would honor the will of the citizens expressed in the elections, which could be represented only by 126 members of parliament, and warned that anything else would be altering the will of the people, usurping the power and suspending the democratic order
16 May 2008
It is not true that a SPS delegation went today for consultations with the president of Serbia and leader of DS Boris Tadić, which is one more crude deception of the public by Tadić
When I wrote about the inescapable presence of the germ of communism taking root, here and there in Serbia, I was nearly crucified. Dr. Trifkovic makes some minor errors which I can attribute to myself as well - we both (I suppose) love our native country.
But to say "you were too hard on SM" is borderline psychopathic. Nobody can be too hard on any of the communists or neo-communists robed in different colors, (more popular today). Yes, Kostunica is rather brainy, but he's made numerous errors as well. I can't even begin to think about elevating Tadic anywhere beyond the intelectual basement level - however Slobodan Milosevic managed to lead Serbia into an absolute disaster. The comparative prosperity noticed in the recent visit by Dr. T., Dr. Fleming et al. is nothing but an illusion. Again I find some degree of "defending communism" amongst the Serbs who have paid the deerest price for that ill - while the non-Serbian names like (Baily and Averko) seem to have grasped the entire situation rather eloquently. What is the DNK of the Serbs who blindly decline to see the ills that communism bequethed Serbia?
Who ever realized he's wrong and admitted it?
To himself. Never mind others.
Bingo and bingo.
Pity this is not constructive participation to anything. Or maybe not so pity.
What is happening to Serbia was more than predictable. It was inevitable. Long, long ago. Before "communists" or any other succeeding crap. Serbs or Serbia had very little to do with that.
Outcome?
Whatever.
From the Belgrade daily POLITIKA (http://www.politika.co.yu )[my translation]
Exclusively for "Politika"
Moscow, 16 May -- "We have agreed with DSS and SRS on principles of our common government. The talks will continue tomorrow within working groups on finalizing the coalition agreement", said yesterday in Moscow the president of SRS Ivica Dačić after the meeting with Sergej Mironov, the president of Federal Council and leader of Just Russia.
Asked by "Politika" correspondent whether this meant the writing of some of our media that there had been an agreement with the coalition "For European Serbia" was incorrect, Dačić replied:
"Of course, we are a serious party, we cannot have talks with several parties at the same time."
On repeated question, whether this meant that definitively there would not be coalition with DS, the chief of Serbian socialists emphatically stated:
"There will not be."
... ...
@7Bronco
Thats pretty low Israeli firms buying up Serbias economy when its cheap after sanctions and Nato bombardment spurred on by major jewish media companies and journalists/coloumnists in the US as well jewish groups like the Simon Weisenthal centre and politicians and NGOs like Richard Hoolbroke and Tom Lantos and that worm George Soros who made out Milosevic is Hitler and the KLA are freedom fighters. Particulary shameful was there use of Holocaust iconography leading to the perception that a modern day Holocaust against Muslims was occuring.
@12Peter RV
Your right he was murdered (poisoned) not because he was calling witnesses he did that much earlier in the trail but because it was coming to an end and there was not a shred of evidence that he commited any war crimes. Had he been found not guilty that would have been a hugh embarrassment for the hague and question the rationale of why the west was involved in the balkans wars.
Does anyone know a website that list whos on the board of directors of Amnesty International and what there political/financial affiliations are.
What the results of this Serbian elections showed to me is that Serbs from Serbia, think differently then Serbs from Diaspora think (I think that this most likely was the case, pre-WWI, pre and during WWII, and even after WWII, and including today). I would like Srdja to address the history political alignments between Diaspora Serbs and Serbs from Serbia. I believe that both sides were manipulated trough history by multi-outside forces, and thus never united like say the Croatian Diaspora and Croatians. We see this from back in 2000, Serbs from Diaspora were against Milosevic, socialist and nationalists and were all pro-Europe, and pro-democracy, today Serbs from Diaspora support radicals and are clearly against pro-Europe or pro-democracy, while Serbs from Serbia are allegedly pro-Europe or pro-democracy. What happened since 2000, or in less then 8 years, for the political landscape to change so drastically? Now I know that majority of media is owned by western European NGO’s who dictate or attempt to persuade Serbs from Serbia to think pro-Europe and pro-democracy or that the future of Serbia is within EU, and no other options are available for Serbia? All other options for Serbia mean isolation from EU; let’s just say I don’t agree with that point of view. [The fact that EU via NATO bombed Serbia in 1999 and that that illegal aggression led to amputation of 15% of Serbian territory, to most normal thinking people would mean no to EU or NATO.]
I believe that Serbia should freely choose what it wants, whatever that may be, closer ties to Russia and Asian countries, as well as South American countries and perhaps some ties to Europe (with countries that have refused to recognize Kosovo’s independence). That to me does not spell isolation, in fact it promotes diversity. Why should Serbia put all its eggs in one basket? Who gains from having Serbia being part of EU, which would lead to free and unhindered movement eastward? To me the choices are clear just as they were from my father and his father, never sided with the Nazi’s and fascists, and I never will. Now if Serbs can only get the message that just like the lies by Nazi’s prior to WWII the Serbs need to be suspicious of Western Europe, 1999 should have been a warning of things to come, it appears Serbs failed to learn from history.
"Who ever realized he’s wrong and admitted it?
To himself. Never mind others."
Very simple question, let's start from 2000 years ago:
a) Jesus Christ did, he washed the feet of his apostoles
b) St. Francis of Asis did (isolated himself on a hill)
c) Martin Luther did - subjected himself to the strictest Augustine requirements to realize the deapth of his sin and the temerity of his conviction.
I think those three will do. I am not counting Zinoviev who proclaimed "I am a capitalist spy and a dog", under the guidance of the ever-liberating Communism.
What man wouldn't openly admit his short-comings in the name of the "brighter future"? Tadic certainly tried when he apologized to the Croats and Bosnians but for all the wrong reasons.
If a human being is incapable of owning up to the errors of his/her ways - there is no confession, no atonement (making amends), no salvation (neither theologicaly nor sociologicaly)
e) Richard Nixon admitted his wrong-doings.
# 20 Walter
There is not that big a difference in the current political alignments between Serbians in Serbia and those in Diaspora. The Internet and affordable travel opportunities enabled Serbians to inform themselves about the outside world promptly although sometimes not that correctly. Some Serbians still live in the Utopia-land of make-believe that someone else but themselves would “bring” them prosperity and wealth. I thank God for those who voted for Dr. Kostunica in this election – there is still hope for SERBIA!!!
I am quite surprised that Israeli investments are coming to Serbia...I mean it was the Jewish American groups that led the military onslaught against Serbia.
In the final analysis, Radical government will never be accepted, as their ascendancy to power is tantamount to counterevolution. Kostunica's role has always been of the leader who would eventually bring the country through reforms however slowly and without bloodshed. Under his helm, time was given to the Radical and Socialist parties to reform and redefine themselves in a workable and not nation destructive format. But this had not happened. Should Kostunica chose to lead a counterevolution instead, his political career would be over. It is one thing to demand a hard line over Kosovo and assume the prerogative only a King should enjoy when defining true Srbianism. It is quite another to bring back the completely disastrous policies of the past that have absolutely no chance of success, policies which only lead to complete self-destruction. Without capitalism there is no economic growth. Without property rights there is no rule of law and with the language of violent nationalism ultimately there is no democracy. It is time for Serbia to clean the house of the UDBA alumni, who are ultimately behind this conspiracy. This is what Radicals want, but this is not what Kostunica had promised to those who voted for DDS or even those few who would have voted for otherwise. Thankfully, Kostunica's new coalition will never be allowed to assume power, and rightly so. There is no doubt that if the Radicals assumed power, they would never give it up and that they would institute a dictatorship once again. If Kostunica dare present such a government, there will be huge demostrationss and outcry that will last until he gives up. October 5th has been challenged, it is time for a showdown.
My question is related to subject addressed later by Walter Hallstein, #20.
It was cynical question and the answer excludes Saints.
(I cannot recall Richard Nixon realizing much ever since Joe McCarthy up to Watergate anyway.)
Slobodan Milosevic affair is a good, illustrative example.
"Butcher of Balkans, greatest war criminal since Adolf Hitler, came to power by attacking Slovenia then Croatia, ethnic cleanser of his own State, common thief of precious metals, man who lost four civil wars, man who lost Krajina, man who abandoned Bosnian Serbs, man who lost war with NATO," etc, etc, etc.......
Little something for everybody. A reason good enough to object, criticize, hate. Was any of that true? Well, results are in front of us. Perhaps it would be time to step back and reconsider.
Of course not. Why should anyone admit stupidity, naivety, participation in crime against State, Nation, their legitimate Leader, a human being?
At least there is something interesting left to read. Public address to the People after first round of last elections he "lost". Second round never happened, records were carefully destroyed and Serbia finally plunged in present chaos with end in very distant future.
By the way: I have serious trouble identifying "democrats", "pro" and "anti" anything over there. "I-me-mines" I certainly do, at first glance indeed. Is it possible that all pro Serbs are on vacation in sunny Netherlands or I am reading wrong newspapers?
Russia is hosting a meeting of BRIC.
Brazil, Russia, India and China.
The new giants.
Why does Serbia not stay unaligned when that 'bloc' will be up and running as an alternative to Western war criminals and all their vile works.
The USA and the EUSSR are bankrupt in more ways than one.
New government and have a new sovereign and independent future, Serbia. You deserve it after the NATO illegal aggression.
Elizabeth
Erratum @18
"president of SRS Ivica Dačić"
It is SPS, the socialists, of course.
@James (#19)
I think you're wrong about Milosevic's witnesses.
Those witnesses who appeared, were only the prosecution witnesses (Milosevic masterly exposed their false testimonies).
He was just about to start calling his own (among which
was featuring prominently the sleezy ex-president of the U.S.A)
when he had his "heart attack". The firework was just about to begin and Milosevic couldn't have been permitted to direct it.
The humanitarian warriors' justice wasted no time to protect the authors of the humanitarian agression against Serbia.
Dragan Dimitrijevic (#24)
Nothing surprising at all, the voltures dive on the dead corpse.
Re #25
...."...If Kostunica dare present such a government, there will be huge demostrationss and outcry that will last until he gives up. October 5th has been challenged, it is time for a showdown."
You speak like your former disturbed Otpor leader, Ceda Jovanovic. 5th October came and went leaving too many disappointed Serbs, including myself. While Radicals and Socialists are not the best deal, they might be better for Serbia at present than your UDBA’s children Tadic, Ceda and company.
If you want another color-coded revolution in Serbia- forget it. You would not even have an army to lean on to since Tadic sold it to Americans. The best advice to you and Ceda-like monsters is to form a government in exile- and stay there - in EXILE forever !!
Serbia needs to take a breath. Serbia needs peace and jobs nothing else. Jack Bailey your Serbian and Western friends have ruined Serbia, back off of Serbia!
"Dr. Koštunica is now paying the price of his reluctance to part ways with the Eurofanatics and strike a solid deal with the Radicals a year ago, as many of his friends and supporters had urged him to do at the time and as it was certainly in his power to do."
I don't think that the DS-DSS coalition was a bad idea at the time. The strategy was to win over the Europeans, which was eminently possible because 1) the EU would be very reluctant to accept a UDI without UN approval because of the legal chaos and the divisions within EU it would bring; and b) the Americans could ill afford a rift with their European allies. With Russia holding its ground in the UN, Tadic and Kostunica could play the good Serb-bad Serb routine, with brave young Jeremic making the rounds to European capitals spreading good vibes about New Serbia, and promoting the Serbian offer of extra-substantial autonomy and EU-Serbian cooperation in Kosovo's development.
In the end it did not work out. With Bush being unable to keep his big mouth shut, and the question becoming a matter of prestige for the US administration with regard to Russia, the US decided to go on with the UDI anyway. Nevertheless, it was the right strategy to pursue.
#233 Boba,
This is the generation gap I was talking about, the misinformed, uneducated, intellectually challenged individual, which would prefer to be a member of an organization that bombed and destroyed Serbia, that amputated 15% of Serbian territory, and is not done yet, there is still Vojvodina to remove from Serbia, how humiliating, yet to this individual it is this or nothing at all. Even the ordinary uneducated “Seljak” knows right from wrong, yet this European intellectual does not get it. What this individual fails to understand is that Serbia does not need to be tied down by EU beaurocracy in order to prosper economically and politically. Creating stronger ties with other regions is preferable, and an alternative to EU dictates. Russia has already showed its true friendship by allowing Serbia to make money from gas and oil, it will also provide security. I am speechless when I see Serbs that think like foreigners, willing to give up their cultural heritage in order to get a bread crumb being offered as a feast.
za Evropu! , 13/05/2008, 17:10
Neću da živim u Srbiji kojom će vladati kojekakvi nacionalisti, klerofašisti, intelektualno inferiorni i slični likovi. Evropa je jedini izbor! Ne zanima me Kosovski boj i slične izjave u odbrani srpstva, ratovi se više ne vode mačevima ili kopljima kao što mnogi u Srbiji još uvek misle. Nacionalni identitet se brani jedino jakom ekonomijom i pametnim potezima.
http://www.politika.co.yu/index.php?lid=sr&show=rubrike&part=list_reviews&int_itemID=42016
This should have been posted prior to my post #33, oh well…
It appears that Serbs from Diaspora are wrong again once again, wrong in the previous presidential election, and wrong now, most wanted to see a coalition of Tomislav Nikolic’s SRS (Serbian Radical Party) with Vojislav Kostunica’s DSS (Democratic Party of Serbia), but Serbs from Serbia had a different need or were fooled once again into buying the pro-European lies. In reality it will be Serbs from Serbia that will lose the most with the support for a pro-European Serbia; they are supporting the fifth columnists, the enemies of Serbia. It also appears that this is also a generation gap, the values that were once valued are no longer valued, so losing Kosovo for a chance to be a member of EU, the same entity that destroyed Serbia or bombed Serbia in 1999, what are Serbs from Serbia thinking, it is anyone’s guess. I don’t foresee anything good from this election; this may lead to a civil war, just like it did prior to WWII. I am sure that the US and Germany are working hard on scenarios to amputate more land from helpless Serbia; this outcome will send a negative message to those that support Serbia, mainly Russia.
If a civil war would break out in Serbia which is very likely since the west once to finish the job of destroying Serbia once and for all, it will be Serbs from Serbia that will lose their lives in the war, not the Diaspora Serbs. If one looks at the history of Serbian politics from 1914 to 2008 one will see this same pattern being repeated over and over, and the Serbs from Diaspora always supported the opposite of what the Serbs from Serbia supported, and this pattern continues.
I am very confused as well as disappointed in the Serbian people, they were given a clear choice and they refused to choose peace and stability or to stand up to the tyrannical dictates of EU. They chose to forget Kosovo, so the curse of Czar Lazar will continue to haunt future generations of Serbs. They chose to continue and allow EU elite to dictate to Serbia, a shameful act.
So Serbs from Diaspora will be disappointed once again at the election results as well as the wishes of Serbian people, but then again Serbs from Diaspora, the ones that could influence the outcome did not partake in the current election, and thus the Serbian people were once again divided. Unless of course a coalition of SRS, DSS, SPS and few others can create a coalition which would dominate the government, and the first order of business should be to eliminate the foreign NGO’s influence in everyday lives of Serbian people, like television, news papers, etc. Stricter laws that would restrict NGO’s activities which are well known for anti-Serbian agenda should be implemented immediately. The Serbian Diaspora, the rich should try and help the government accomplish the above, and change laws to allow a more investments from abroad. Serbia truly needs to unite, and take control of their destiny, live up to the saying “Samo Sloga Serbina Spasava”…I wonder if this saying was ever true in Serbian history?
"this may lead to a civil war, just like it did prior to WWII."
So I am not the only one who sees this a possible reality.
#35
It is a possible reality since we know from history of Serbia or the Balkans that unjustified outside interference always leads to a war, civil war in one country or a wider war between all Balkan countries. That is the nature of the beast call the Balkans, where nothing is as it appears to be. If this election leads to a civil war it is not the fault of Serbian people but the outsiders playing political chess, with Serbian lives. But what would you know about that, you are just a subjective individual leaking his chops at a prospect of Serbs being punished some more…
I think that what Walter Hallstein writes - ##33, 34 - is completely right. I wish that Serbs living in Serbia could read it and learn something from it. (I wonder if there are such Serbs who do?) Because the situation is quite serious. I wonder why a nation would like to sell themselves, their soul for a piece of (only promised at that) bread. The EU is not what it looks like. As Elizabeth so correctly put it, it is rapidly becoming the EUSSR with diminished political freedoms and rights. What is wrong standing on one's own feet? You could always do business with anybody! - even EU-members! Look at some prosperous countries even in Europe who are not members of the EU - Switzerland, Norway... - they manage just fine. But looking up to those who bombed you - is never right and will lead you nowhere.
Elizabeth and Maie Klark, you ladies are exactly right! And the argument you put forward is so simple yet convincing. But check out the problem: the nationalists are too scared to talk about it, and they simply let the regime rant on about how the path to the eu is the ONLY path to prosperity, jobs and security, although in reality we all know that the eu path forholds the EXACT OPPOSITE of these empty promises!
Ok, to be fair to Kostunica, you can say he always had a pro-european stance (more or less), although the Radicals only adopted one very recently, in the wake of relentless regime propaganda bombarding ordinary people with fear about 'isolation' and 'economic despair', and THIS is the problem! In reality, we all know that Radicals' position is essentially non-alligned (and very correctly so), but they realise that telling people the facts would be entirely counter-productive, given the circumstances.
Maybe now that a 'national unity' government can finally be informed, then the coalition will hopefully have the opportunity of time to debunk many of the overhyped stupidities of the current regime, and that the people will be slowly won over. In any event time is ALL Serbia needs, because the western establishment will eventually be revealed for the sinking ship that it is, both economically and politically, and by that time the Serbian people will be thanking God they didn't embark on that ship, God willing!
Just to let you all know I'm only 27, but there are quite a few young people even younger than myself (Serbs especially) that hold firm moral beliefs and values. It's a particularly tough world for the likes of us to adjust to; at least the ignorrant youth believe they have a carefree existence. oh well...:)
To those who see an upcoming civil war in Serbia: The Serbs who voted either Radical or Pro-European don't really feel strongly about either side to go out and die for them. Also, more than half the Serbs didn't even bother to vote which shows that there is more listlessness than entrenchment within the population.
CCCC
As has been said: only unity saves the Serbs.
The enemies of Serbia would love to see an actual war between Serbs.
Having political differences short of war is a different matter.
There will be no civil war in Serbia.
I congratulate Walter Hallstein on these words: " I am very confused as well as disappointed in the Serbian people, they were given a clear choice and they refused to choose peace and stability or to stand up to the tyrannical dictates of EU. They chose to forget Kosovo..." Well, majority of Serbs did not forget about Kosovo, neither they will. It is Tadic's lot that make such an impression. But, I respect your rebuke and hope the Serbs will hear it and form the national unity Government.
It is true that the Serbs betrayed Kostunica in these elections and I fail to see the reason for that. But, I wish him to form the Government with the SRS and SPS. Serbia definately needs change.
Why should the new Government be against the Serbia economic prosperity, political stability and economic ties with the whole world? There is no one single reason for that.
Elizabeth and Maie Kark, thank you for your constructive thoughts. The national unity Government is to be looking towards the BRIC countries, and these days Russia, India and China (2.5 billion people!) are urging the renewal of the Kosovo status talks!
James @5: Milosevic faught very hard and did show the travesty of the Balkan wars. That is exactly the reason the trial was under-reported in the West and why he was denied a proper medical care and then "self-medicated". Please read the following book: "Travesty: The Trial of Slobodan Milosevic" by John Laughland. The Milosevic trial was a herroic one and his legendary defense simply - brilliant.
Let me add this little comment. When everything comes around, it is perhaps not exactly criminal to wish to become a member of the EU, but in that case IT HAS TO BE ON SERBIA'S OWN TERMS! And that only! I am quite positive that in the end it is the EU who starts 'flirting' with Serbia to get it onboard. There have always been talks about how strategic the geographical position of Serbia is in Europe, its importance on the Balkan stability, etc. Why not wait and see how things develop by themselves? Why rush into something unprepared and stupidly? It may finally show that it is the EU who needs Serbia most, not the other way round. After all, the EU-bureaucrats can think of including the Western Balkan states into their colossum - an entirely different matter being Russia, for example.
Greetings from one who has long experience from both the USSR and EUSSR!
@42, Maie Kark:
Exactly!
#33 Walter: .."I am speechless when I see Serbs that think like foreigners, willing to give up their cultural heritage in order to get a bread crumb being offered as a feast..."
I agree with you 100%!!! I am shocked by seeing how many young (and middle aged) Serbians there are who care more what Americans would "think" of them than what happens to Serbia.
We had more patriotic education under communists than the current generation under democrats -"multiculturalists "!
#39 Dragan,
To those who see an upcoming civil war in Serbia: The Serbs who voted either Radical or Pro-European don’t really feel strongly about either side to go out and die for them. Also, more than half the Serbs didn’t even bother to vote which shows that there is more listlessness than entrenchment within the population.
No one is whishing for civil war but one must not ignore history of the Balkans and Serbia; one can see from history that almost every time there is a major power shift in Europe it affects the Balkans, and the result has always been either a civil war affecting one country or it may lead to a wider conflict…what am I trying to say is that outsiders always used the Balkans to start wars, history can’t be ignored, one must learn from history. Also it is not true that more then half the Serbs didn’t bother to vote, according to Republic of Serbia Republic Electoral Commission (RIK) as of 12.May.2008, at 10:30 pm, with 99.58% percent of votes counted of registered 6,721,312 voters and 60.97 percent voted, obviously more then half voted, the others were discouraged and manipulated into inaction by foreign owned NGO media outlets.
Some more thoughts. With this unheard of harassment and persecution of the Serbian people which has been going on for so many years now, I think it is very unwise to strive after all these “Euro-(Atlantic?!) integrations”. The EU itself which has become an unmanageable colossus – due to its too many members – you can expect that it will never again be able to speak in ‘one voice’!
- looks anyway down to its new Eastern-European members and treats them as ‘poor cousins from the countryside’ whom it feels it has the right to dictate to – and they in their turn act as obedient slaves! But it is much worse for Serbia in whom it has chosen to reflect itself, i.e. project all its prejudices, aggressions, etc. on. Serbia should not accept constantly being tramped on and beaten, it’s just too humiliating in the end. But the EU has not shown any sign of letting up its vilifying policies. The large and mostly shallow-thinking EU-citizenry must to a 70-80% be completely brainwashed by American/NATO/EU propaganda. And so they continue. These are the enemies of the Serb people. You have nothing good to expect from them. All they do is lie to you and manipulate you. So, let nobody dictate to you. And least of all – you should have anything to do with NATO – the criminal organization that bombed you – its only rightful place – long time overdue – is in the graveyard.
#40 Michael Averko,
CCCC
As has been said: only unity saves the Serbs.
But was it ever true in Serbian history? Why hold on to slogans that are empty and not true, it is a new world today and we need new slogans that reflect current reality on the ground.
The enemies of Serbia would love to see an actual war between Serbs.
This has always been and always will be, that is why all Serbs need to learn Serbian history.
Having political differences short of war is a different matter.
This is true but outside forces have used such scenarios [when Montenegro declared independence – it was instigated by outside forces] for their own interests and always against Serbian interests [amputation of 15% of Serbian territory], we can clearly see this from the last 28 years. I asked this question before I wonder if Srdja or someone else did a study of political differences between Diaspora Serbs and Serbs from Serbia, I suspect that both always had opposing views, at least from 1918 to 2008, which might explain the difference of point of view and the results of this election.
#41 Goran,
…Well, majority of Serbs did not forget about Kosovo, neither they will. It is Tadic’s lot that make such an impression. But, I respect your rebuke and hope the Serbs will hear it and form the national unity Government.
I am not sure about that, you have nothing to back your assertion with, if this election is any indicator then it is approximately a 51%/49% tie between keeping Kosovo and forgetting Kosovo, not a clear result, but from talking to young Serbs between the age of 17-34 they are more interested in starting their lives and making money, they are all for closer ties with Europe or EU, see my post #33.
There is still hope that Kostunica will form a new government and that government will continue to fight for Kosovo, as well as look for alternative economical as well as military alliances, this is what EU is really worried about, independent Serbia in the heart of Europe, this could discourage further integration into EU, the European elite know this and are now hard at work to stop Serbia from doing what I suggest closer tie to Russia, China, India, and other countries, that want alternatives to WTO, WBO, IMF, etc.
The young people of Serbia also need more alternatives then what is being offered by EU, I think new government needs to promote and attract high tech industry, the rich Diaspora Serbs from America and other countries need to invest in Serbia now, so a stable Serbian government is a must. I challenge the rich Diaspora Serbs to do something now.
SAMO INAT SERBINA SPASAVA
#42 Maie Kark,
Exactly right, Serbia in EU on Serbia’s terms and after EU pays war reparations for the illegal 1999 bombing, and the unilateral recognition of Kosovo’s independence needs to be annulled. The solution to Kosovo is clear, those ethnic Albanians that want to live in peace with Serbs can stay in Kosovo, those that do not, have an alternative it is called Albanian. This should be the starting basis for talks on Serbia’s EU membership, no alternatives should be accepted.
46 Maie Kark,
…But the EU has not shown any sign of letting up its vilifying policies. The large and mostly shallow-thinking EU-citizenry must to a 70-80% be completely brainwashed by American/NATO/EU propaganda. And so they continue. These are the enemies of the Serb people. You have nothing good to expect from them. All they do is lie to you and manipulate you. So, let nobody dictate to you. And least of all – you should have anything to do with NATO – the criminal organization that bombed you – its only rightful place – long time overdue – is in the graveyard.
I fully agree, no to EU (unless it is on Serbia’s terms), and no to NATO (on any terms). The Balkans, historically speaking has been a graveyard of the Empires; odds are history will repeat itself.